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C ZOUSE 0P REPRESENTATIVES '
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i 1. ssvs - SIGHTH GxvqnAc AsssMnLv :'
- PORYZ-EIGHTH LEGISLATIVE IJAY (^). (^). ; i c .. MAY 3, 1973^ '!
. ' f lo :oo o 'cLocK A -M. (^) : ' vHs HouoRABLE W. ROBERT BLAIR, SPEAKZR r^ ' '^ IN THE CHAIR^ ' - .'''.à'
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A Roll Call for attendance was taken and Indicated that ' all were present with the exception of the following: - Represenkative Ben C. Blades - 1llness) Representative Richard A. Carter - no reason given;^ .: Representative Charles J. Fleck - illness ; '.. '' ' - ..',..'' '..'...;â$..I$''. ,. '.. Representative Peter C. Granata - illness; ' ' ' .. Representative Robert H. Holloway - no reason given;. 'J (^).^ '.. (^). 'r'$ ' (^) Representative James G. Krause - 1llness ;.. .' ' ',' (^) ,r'' .. :' Representative Isaac R. Sims - no reason given. (^) ,. 4' u : s.^ ....^..^ .. ' (^) .. '.^ $. !..
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to which House Bill 6l9 was referred reported same back with recommendation that bills do pass and be re-referred to Appropriatidns. Mr. Soderstrom from Elementary and àecondary to which House àills 685, 977, 1099,* 1191 were ' (^). -. -... (^) .... referred reporked same back with Amendments tùereto with recommendation that tée amendments be adopted and the bills as amended do pass.^.^.^.^ Mr. Soderstrom from Elementary.^.^ F^. an'd secondary to which House Bills 781, logie'and 1143 w'ere referred reporied same back with recommendation that the bills do pass. Mr. Soderptrom from Elementary and Se'condar
. (^) to which Houie Bill 1033 was referred reported same back
with recommendation that theebiil do pas's. Mr. Duff from Judiciary 2 to which House Bill 8l4 was referred reported same back with recommendation that the bill do pass. Mr. Duff from éùdiciary 2 to which House Bill 757, 889, and 900 were referred same back with amendments thereto with ' rzcommendation that the amendmepts be adopted and the bi 1zs as amended ào pàss. Mr. walz from Reglstration and Regulation to which House Biïl 7#8 and 1068 were referred reported same back with recommendation ihat the bills do pass. Mr. Wall from Registration and Regulation to which
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House Bill 824 was reférred reported same back with recoméendation that the' bill do pas's. Mr. wall from Registration and Regulation to which House Bill 825 was^7. referred reported same back with the recommendation tiat the bill do pass and be re-referred to Appropriations. Mr. Randolp'h from Revenue to which House Bill 728 and 8l ''A rr^ x Ge'':^117 e /l; % t'i .'cfx-t -p ''k? G ENERsv (^) wAL Axso,'u SSE5u,xo'sfBLY î /à: 4 ..-r='e
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were referred reported same back with recommendation that the bills do not pass. Mr. Randolph from Reve'nue to which House Bills 888, 994, and 1080 Were referred reported same back with recommendakion that the bills do pass. Mr. Randolph from Revenue to which House Bill 964 was referred reported sam'e back with amendments tiereto and the recommendation that the^ ' khè dmentsn ' be a'dopted and the bill do pass. Vr. Neff ftom Transportation to which House n Bill 869, 996, and 1012 were referred reported same back w'ith recommendation that tha bills âo pass and be placed in the 'order of Second Reading. Mr. Neff from Committee on Transportation to which House Bill 1063 was referred reported same back ewith recommendation that the bill do pass and be re-referred to Appropritations. Mr. Neff from
. Transportation .to which House Bill 1680 was referrea same
back with amendments thereto with reco= endation thai the ' (^). (^) amendments be adopted and the bills as amended do pass. Mr. Tuerck from Indusvéiar Afèairs to which House Bill,l was referred reported same back with recommendation that
. (^) the Sili do not p'ass. Mr. Tuerck from Industria'ï Affairs
to which kouse Bill 1072 and 1074 were referred reported * 'same back with the recommendatioh that the bills do pass. w. Robert Bl^. air: ,,Arev there messages #ro m.the se'naiean Fred selcke: ''X messageffom the Senate by Ai. Ferindes, secretary. Mr. speake/, I am directed to inform the House of Representatives that the Senate has passed the
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! I (^6). l^ '^ Immacula'te conceptio'n, springfield-'' !. ' Sullivanz ''Ask of a'll of us here present to take a few mom'ents in prayer for Representative Ben Blades who last evening ' (^) ... was taken ill and is now in Memorial Hospital. So let us pause for a moment to ask God ko qrant him good health. Mighty and eternal God You are the source of a11 true ' W isdom ,dignity and dedicaked work. We a'sk Your blessing
. on al1 of us here present in this House of Reprèsentatives.
Just as #ou called leaders to lead and protect Your people in the prophets of old; give us, today , dedicated leaders in government who will serve Your people witi juitice an'd honor. Never may they be afraid to be open and honest to their elected reiponsibility'and ever may they be present o'f Your presence in tieir work. Long may our land be / bright with freedom and Holy light. Protect us by Y.our might for today we proclaim You are our great God and King. Amen .O W. Robert Bl-air: ''Roll call for attendancetn W. Robert Blair: ''The Ge^.^ nkleman from Cook, Mr. William'Wals^1 .hw'' Walsh: pMr. speaker, will the journal show that Represen'tatives Granata, Fleck, and Blades are absent because of illnessp'
W Robert Blair: ''The journal will so i/dicate. Airiihik
'House Bills Third Reading.- kouse Bill 293.'' Fred Selcke: ''House Bill 293. An 'act limitin'g saïa'ry increase for State officers, mnmhers of the êeneral Asémmhly and Judges/ Third Reading of ihe Bi11.R I /'^ #r ''^ .t^ f> 'NL G E N E R A L A SSE M B L Y (^1) y. <; '>' z 1 ,rt ..z 1Aa ,- STA.T'E oF 1uu#blo 1 S
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). (^) 7. W. Robert Blair : ''The Genkleman from Cooke Mr. Hoffman.' The ) '^ '^ r' 'c.- e 7 : G nEle man from union ',Mr. choate-'' Choate: ''Mr. speaker, would you please have the record to 1 indicatethatRepresentativexrauseisabsentbecauseof illness.''.. k. Robert Blair: ''The journal will so indicate. The Gentle. : man.
- (^) from Cook, Mr. Ron Hoffman .'' '
Hoffman: ''Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. House Biil 293 is an act limitfn'g salary ln'cre'ases' for State officers,member's ef the General Asreébly, Judges. Limits increases to same percentages granted State èmployeeslacross the board, a cost of living increaie. Ever since I have been in this Geveral Ass-mhlye we have
h had much criticism heaped ufon us as 'a lsgislative body
for considering extraordinary increasesy hot only for
ourse l ves, but for the judiciary and de/aétmen't heads.
This bill seeks to place guide ilines on it so that at no time, this legislative body would consider extraordinary (^).
. increases, any one o: these caEegories,^ wlthout taklng
into account what we are doing for the State employees. ,.
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I tiink for a long time tie public- has been awa're' that we '^ .'.^.^ '^.^.^ (^ 'w.^ ' set our bwn rules down here, and at many times we seem to J-T r flv in the face of Dublic opinion.^ a^.^ ..^.^ We reaïiz'.^ : e that the ) ''' '' *' ' cost of living is going up, but we should also be aware.
that the cos^ '^ t of living is goin'g up 'for a1l of our' i
employees. State employees under the code or elecéed (^ , - X''.^.^ <!^ G E^ N^ E^ R A^ L^ A ssEM B^ LY
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code, or lpgislators. Wheh we are increasing is across
the b ard...o the cost o/ livin'g increa'se of 3 1/2 o: 4
per cent to the State employees, then we would be' under ' the same percentage, we coùld not increase our salary or the judiciary in excess ofo'' ' sheai ''Let m'e read it'again, maybe 1''11 be back in a second, if you donb't mind-''. W. Robert Blair: ''Alright, in the meantime, in the back of the hall, is our former collegue and good friende Representati Ed Lehman, a...standing back there. The Gentleman flam Cook, Mr. Eptono'' Epton: '!Mr. Speaker', Ladies and Gentlemen of the House. It is
with reluctance that I ar s i eto opfose my good friend's
bill. Especially , r 'should like to call to the House's attention that this certain'ly might have a conflict of interest, since I have a brother w o ù is a sitting Judge; however, he reàently received a rais'e and I doubt that
. (^) in the near future we will agaln have that under discussio.
ào that I can, as a practicing attorney, and a m-rher of the legislature, speak on a subject khich I think, is perhaps being looked upon by the public, even, in the
. wrong light. The judges of this n'ation have pe:haps been
the greatest single force for stability that we have ever faced.^. I know it is a very popular thing tjoda y to r sej. an d call down the wrath of the legislature and the' people upon the judges, but k^.^ he fact is, that they are bo'^ und! /'r (^) ..y'kvlrw r G E N E R A L A S S E 51B L Y
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laws by the Constitution, and almost withèut exception/
with rare exception, they do a very tremendous job. The news media kakes deliiht in talking about the judge who is corruptz the judgee who pe^ :) rhaps' has short hourse but there are thousands of judges, just like there are thousands of legislat^ ' ures who s 'pen d hour aft er hour and : day àfier day pondezing o'ver' decisions, decis'ions which ' effect thb lives of you an'd me and our neighbors. The fac is that to bind our hands, to tie a situation io tie c'ost of living as far as judicial increases really is fo'lly.' Judges have a c'ertain,rvand rightfully so, a'certain exhaulted position in our society. Its unfortunate but when a judge abused ik and brings discredit when a lawyer ' (^) abuses his tru'stg he brings discredit upon the'entire profession. A bill like this, however, is not in the best interest of'the people, even if the people were to be lieve it so. I submit that this legislature' is fes'pon- sive to the peopble. Whenever we a'llow a judge's judicial ' '^. increase, we answer to the people shortiy therea-fter. I think in our great wisdom', we can determin'e what district, what judges. what classification should be reA'mhursed.. I think it would be in error to or'iginaliy tie'the hands of this legislature a^. nd others and I respec. ky ly u y umga you ' to vote agiinst this pending bi11.% W. (^) Ro er b k Blair: ''Any further discu'ssionz The Gentlem' an from cook #Mr. shea-'' ,''r A.
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l2. do is put a bit of rationality in here and make the percen of inérease that we eonsider for ourselves or the judiciar within the realm of commen iense, by considerinq the State employees before we consid^.^ - er ours^ ) elves or the judiciary. I don't think this legislakion' is unreasonable. I think it is a step in t%e right direction. I think public con*idence demands thai we do sometking to limit some of t e'xtraordinary increas'es that we have' confronted ourself and the public with in the past few years and I again, would elude to the fact that the percent:ges that we are c'onsidering even based upon what you'have indicated to us a're not unreasonable', and I do not think that they would instiEute pressure upoh us to raise'them to these maximums.e W. Robert Blair/ ''Alright, Mr. B. B. Wolfe?'' Wolfe: nWill the Speaker.ooowith tie sponsor for a question, .i^ Mr. Speaker?'' w. Robert Bïair: ''He indicates he' will.'' Wolfe: ''A.... common sense is, and shoul: be the guide'lines
for a good faw miker and legislature, so let's look at
your bill a minute, Ron. Judges are elected every s^ ' ix years, rightz'' Hoffman: DRight.'' wolfe: ''Supreme Court juètices every ten yevars-' Now you are going to give them a standard, and I don't know whether the law , I know with reference. to any State official, you can't raise their salaries or decrease their salaries
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l^ ' Hofféan: pcorrect-''
Wolfe: 'êNow what are you going to do with a four-year man that is involved with a coit of living increase in 19 73 and 1974# you are going to waii u'n'til the end'of 't'his term and then' apply this stan'dard of ru'le to determine ho'w 'much money he st ho'ul; be getting? 'Aid then a're you g. oin'g to give him that money, or are you still going to use the..^.^ '^ p^. s an i dard of the value or the compensaiion that that office SSOVIY CYZWOO ' Hoffman: ''First, you are sbarting with the premisë, Represen- : ' tative, that all judiciary, or a1l legislators are under- pa'id.' I ditatree with that concept/ One of the things that I have always felt very strongiy, in that ceriain areas of the judiciary were under'aid ap nd I think in the last few sessions, we have b/ought them up to parity. I think ihe legislative body, contrary to the recommendation. .'^ : 'recei'^ ve. (^) d, is adequatel-y pai^ d, and consequentl.^ '^ y, tiis...' the ,
. J . '^ .'' (^) Pt .a...point that you are eluding to only indicates to me '.. .'.^ ' '^. .**.C
' (^) a at you feel that everyone of these areas is underpa ' ,^ '^ and should be a.o..^.^.^1 a...prepared to consider extraordinary^ ...^.^ -^..^.^. , k
. '^ raises within their individual sterms.e '. ) ' . wozfe: '^.^ 'xo---no, z aidn't say,..i^ hatw That wasn'.^ t my ques.^ tion.'^ ': '.^.
My question was, what do you do at the end of a terma... '
. what ao you do at the end of a term- based upon the cost '
of living'increases and so forth that w'e have been' faced .''^ xv'^. ;N xN.
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of officials on 2, 4, 6, and 10 year p'eriods, then I think you might have quote...a commen sense type of bill.* Hoffman : 01 disagree, Representative# I see nothing dis- criminatory in thi's in'asmuch as w'hen a dentlemany whether in this House or any other aspect runs fo'r the officey he
' inows the term o/ that o/fice, he knbows'the length of that
O ffice ,and he' knows the compensakion that exists at that time.D ' :T( 7 l#ez ''Ron, we are no't talking about that. We are talking about your bill which provides for a' cosi of livinq increase. Now'either it provides for it or ii does not- And if it does not it is discriminakory.'' Hoffman: ''This does not provide anymore than what exists for ' us now, a general across the board cost of living increase - Increases in salary for the legislative body has to ée done by legislation. A1 ' 1 this d es 3 is instituta quide ' (^) lines that it cannot e-xceed that percent given to State employeesk''. ' W^ ' v, ' jk' o
. Robert Blair:. The Gentleman from McHenry, Mr. Sk nner.
skinner:^ ' ''Mr. speakerh w ill the Gentleman yield for a question. I presume he will. could the spon'so'r tell me what this is limited to state officials and does not include county officialsz'' Hoffman: .'If I heard the queskion: Represen. tasiv-e skinner, in reference to county officiàl's?''. SKinner: nYes.'' APDA y ! , x(; z'P )rt..h svxvsos,uulxols ï.rzzz' --=-..et#'.J ..-..-- -- --------.-.-...--
l6. legislative body and the Judiciary w'as under extreme criticism'at the time and co'nsequently y this is why the
bill was put in and worded as such. I had notk to my
khowledge, and even today, had too much emphasis put on county o fficials bùing 'put'in *he s'ame categoty.'' ' (^) Skinner: ''Well, I would suggest that when I took office as
Treasurer in 1966, my salary wis 25% higher than'my predessor's salary, a'nd when my successor took o'ffice in 1970, her salary was 60% higher than my salary was. And it seems to me that khe legislation, if it is needed , is not needed just fo'r state officials, it is needed for every pùblic official in the State of Illinois. I think that they ought to be treated equally before the lawao Hoffman : ''I would agree with you Representative Skinner , and I would be more than happy to co-sponsor a bill of that X PeY w Roser, s?atr, ''vhe cez.tzeznan zrcm ccok .x.k- rake vol,e-', wol ezf ''Mr. p s eaker , I move the 'previous quùstion-'' ' W. Robert.Blair: All those in favor say aye. Opposedy no. The ayes have it: The Gentleman from Cook, kr. Ron ' Hoffman. to close-''. ' Hoffma'n: nTha'nk you, Mr. speaker, Ladies and Géntlemen'of this House. since ï have been down here, we have had much crit c â ism through the media, b'ack in the disiri'e/, for anticipated pay raises. Now everyone of us knows. and the people who criticizes us know, that the cost of livihg is goâng up. I 'm not saying with this piece of legislation
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sacred cows. At tEe present time; they are enrichedy they
are honored and they 'are sealed into'office'for a'lffe- time tenure. We need to hea'r the voice of our constituents and put a very fair and reasonable provision on the staku'te book. We have one of the distinguished Represen- tat ves i 'f rom Chica o say we might not get a chance to voteg for another.pay raise.. For his informakion, there is a ' bill oèer in the Senate righk now, S. B. 920, that giv'es .khe j .udges j5% pa y raise, Represenkat ve.z a tonp. ay na what could be fairer than limiking these peo'ple Eo the sare standard of pay raise as the other public servants. There is azother bifl over in the senaie coming téis wa'y that aeserves your attention , and that is S.J'.R. 26, it'1l make it possible io restore the proposition tha't judges should ru n against live kicking opponents instead of being' sealed into office under the presento.oye's-'no vote. I urge each of you to vote yes on a very good idea. It is very fair and your constituënts will appreciate your effortoe
. W. Robert Blair:. ''The Gentleman from Cook, Mr. Epton.e. , ' ' . Epton :^ ''Mr. Speaker , Ladies and Gentlemen of the House.^ I
. ..iùink I'd better give notice to thls House right not tùat
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. :I ha've just about had it as far as the iax on tEe legal
.' (^) profess On ar' i 'e concerne. d- ' z ama momhe'r of ihe l/gal profession. I am a proud meéber of a proud prof^.^.^ essi'on.^. I And I resent a.^ ny attorney or a. ny individual get ks ng u.p .su^ I th is House and telling-- explaining why we sho'uld or shoul i tk^.^ x. z! s.$ï^ G E^ N E R A L^ A S^ S^ E M B L^ Y^.
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'ë!t 'no t d o thi: 01 do that becau nt you a1 1 s
E (^). on March : (^) ' ana I wa (^) '. , explain to YOu Gentleman z^ :0zth , thss gill be my s,' ffl1Y ' Yecau^ se hence ''
l to 1 i sten care to tie ths s uouse ug until . J''
'^ t dure , and i:^ you^ want^ lked about^.^ ,
proce (^) it on Marèh B , Whenwe ta x:- oecember , 1,11 do^ -^. en and NGOea got '. (^). hool boards'twelve m ., (^) men. and YOmen on sc (^) uool boards andtuey.
). ' a spoke Vho are member s o: sc m as to hOG '
' up an. (^) sa vith great wisdo ' (^) spoke <' ith great clarity a (^) i11 he futule,. (^5) 1 board b. In t
j we shoui a vote on the schao ue scuool board bi 1 1.
fzmAiz SO*ted On t 1 E that they 'yarmers, )' sugges (^13) nine men gOt up and sgokewho are s ana what on Mafch ' (^) roblems ofthe farmel talked a^ bout the P yistened <sth ' ahd they^ t we shon^ 1d / t,^ ao^ ,^ and 1. -
..^.^ hould^ ao and *ha^ n and wom .w-.^ six
we s (^) theze weresix me interest. on March 1S,^ liquoraistribution
. e invoYv^ ed in Yhe '
men who sPOue, who ar (^). lving thela year ke on a Probleminvo field, and they sPO o into-^ aetail as sae. I won .t even g. c 1ds an a beer and V cesentatives who : (^) é men Wh o are uniora rap s will.
. (^) , to t^ he n^ umbef O^ nion bi1is.^ As alaoyer, . (^). with eloquence on u. ts the 1egal
.speak (^) suat ï tuinu effec ,
- '^ k on everY ZCSZZ Xill ,. ' without anY ..^ spea^ wkthoutqanyshame '
: (^) profession , ana I do it , (^) yong bee'^. .n a fine (^) in- y' (^) e. The 1e;ai prO fession ha%. 'through .'. .. (^) aefens. (^) en cam e.^ up here,and. t',^..^ ana yet men a nd wom. (^) aastardly -.
. stitution, (^) tuerwise,. it is
.;'^ thei r eloquence, sugge sted as O (^) a lemen , Me' wilt , r. ladies an gent As fax as I am concerned,^. te it UPor down I. se wilt VO
l: . stickto the meri Sy o: a bi 1 1. '
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